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 Posted - 21 October 2004 : 21:17:04
Jai Shree Krushna !What is the basis of social class system? How was it at the time of Shree Mahaprabhuji and how he looked at it as a social reformer even though the caste system still remained prevalent? Jai Shree Krushna,
Dharmendra
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vinod
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Posted - 22 October 2004 : 00:38:02
Dear Vaishnav
Jai Shree Krishna
"WITH DUE RESPECT"
You are learned Vaishnav, and the first part your question does not require detailed explaination.
Most of the answers you are seeking in the matter of social class system is in many pushtaks whicH I am sure you have read it.
Now as for the second part of the question, you will have to pardon my intelligence, was there any social reformation or was there "Elevation" to a degree to maintain the socio-eco for the very reasons Politicians are struggling- welfare,economics etc.
There is also an aricle on this website, LIBRARY, and then follow Pushti Parimal, RULES OF CONDUCT,
and perahps you will find some answers you are seeking?
Vinod
Edited by - vinod on October 22 2004 00:39:37
Jai Shree Krishna
Vinod Savjani
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gopal
Pushtikul Elite Member - August 2003
1221 Posts
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Posted - 22 October 2004 : 10:36:50
Jai Jai ShriGokulesh,
ShriMahaprabhuji is a strong believer of shastras, and in our veds it is described to follow the varnashram vyavastha. Which Shrimahaprabuji very carefully carried forward it. No doubt that aapshri made stri and shudras the sevaks, but the varnashram vyavastha was not disturbed.
Jai Jai ShriGokulesh Parivaar, Baroda
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shreekant22
PRO - Pushtikul.com / P.E.M. January 2004
1853 Posts
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Posted - 22 October 2004 : 10:59:13
Jai Shree Krishna
It is also important here to remember that, Shree Mahaprabhujis pragatya on bhutal was for the uddhar of those jeevs who had been left behind by Shree Thakorji at vraj during his avtaar. Their uddhar was the only objective, and hence he accepted these jeevs irrespective of their cast and creed. Shree Vallabh did 3 times prithvi parikrama, with out any footwear, so that even those jeevs who had takne form as insects etc, may also be relieved of their lifecycles by the sparsh matr of his charan.
Shree Vallabha dheesh ki jai
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vinod
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Posted - 22 October 2004 : 18:41:32
Dear Shreekantbhai
Jai Shree Krishna
3 Times Prithvi parikrama, Does it mean Bahart Only or does it refer to WHole World?
Vinod
Jai Shree Krishna
Vinod Savjani
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shreekant22
PRO - Pushtikul.com / P.E.M. January 2004
1853 Posts
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Posted - 22 October 2004 : 18:48:14
Jai Shree Krishna
Vinod bhai, the three parikramas where restricted to bharatvarsh only, not the whole world. This in those days of mutiny and oppression is in itself great shram to our Shree Vallabh.
It is refered to as prithvi parikrama, to make people understand the stupendous task, and more of a relative term than a specific mention. A practice more followed in those days.
Shree Vallabha dheesh ki jai
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shreekant22
PRO - Pushtikul.com / P.E.M. January 2004
1853 Posts
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Posted - 22 October 2004 : 18:57:11
Jai Shree Krishna
Also may add that, in the period we are refering to, there was only poetry, pros had not yet made its presence, in the written form.
Pros as in written form was brought by Shree Vallabh. The credit of Bringing in Pros in Hindi sahitya goes to him, for the very first pros compositions were made by the Acharya and that to in Vraj bhasha. The Allahabad univesity celebrated 500 years of Shree Mahaprabhujis birth centinery for the very purpose.
Shree Vallabha dheesh ki jai
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ANJLI
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Posted - 22 October 2004 : 23:39:09
Vallah Vaishnavs
Jai Shree Krsna
Coming back to the orginal topic, my thoughts and views are directed to the following:
In the Gitaji, Lord Krishna has explained systematically, the essential nature of each one of these being, especially those born in the human kingdom. They can be dichotomized as 'daivi' (pious, blessed souls) and 'asuri' (demonic) 'jeev'.
Now Dharemadrabhai, you decide?
Anjli
JAI SHREE KRSNA
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117 Posts
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Posted - 25 October 2004 : 12:08:26
Jai Shree Krushna !
Thanks for many responses which are partly true. Vinodbhai's view is correct that it was more of 'elevation' than reform. Gopalbhai's answer is very brief but centered correctly. Shreekantbhai's thinking is again divine. Thanks for sharing the additional piece of information. Will come to Anjaliji's answer after summarizing the topic.
The basis of class system is first mentioned in the Rigved PurushSukta 10th Mandal where it is said that Brahman, Kshatriya, Vaishya and Shudra appeared from the mouth, arms, thighs and feet resp. of the parbrahm Purush. Gita also describes these four divisions based upon quality and functions. Thus this class system is God-made for the social order and harmonious living. In the Vedic times, if a person didn't possess the qualities or functions of the class in which he was born, then he would not be considered a member of that class. Function wise, a Brahman would educate, Kshatriya would protect, Vaishya supply means of livelihood and Shudras serve other classes manually. However, in due course of time, orthodox people believed birth alone as a criteria for the caste of a person. In the time of Shree Mahaprabhuji, to sustain the foreign attacks, there seemed a need for generating small groups which led to sub-castes and subsub-castes. In such a system, inter-marrying and inter-dining even among the members of the divisions of the same caste were forbidden. Also, each man deviated from the duty of his class and maintained by livelihood of other classes.
Shree Mahaprabhuji saw the evil of castes, and wished to reform it, but he didn't want to blow the old Vedic system which gave shelter to people for thousands of years. His attitude towards caste was that of renovation and not demolition. He looked upon the problem philosophically and religiously. Considering the current status as Will of God, he proposed that a man may belong to any social class/caste, but should feel that he is given birth in that class, for rendering service to God. If he does his duty honestly and sincerely and regards as a duty to God, he will not act against the scriptures. Moreover, by putting all his sevaks under the Vaishnav category beyond class, creed or colour, and making caste a subordinate, he united them and elevated them all without disturbing the social order.
Shree Mahaprabhuji correctly diagnosed the social disease and cured it ingeniously without a blow. The Hindu society not only survived the Islamic attacks, but also had a long lease of life under the impact of his social philosophy.
This completes the series of questions mainly addresses to a layman or beginner's perception of our Acharyashri's stand on youngsters, women, shudras, castes, muslims etc. As vaishnavs, we may consider everything as divine lila, but when faced with a generic situation, we must be able to defend and speak our social values which are ever fresh and modern. It is more important, because many of these problems still persists, even in vaishnav families, largely due to ignorance.
For more details on these issues, one can see :
(1) Shree Vallabhacharyaji nu Jeevan Charitra, by Lallubhai P Parekh, 1923
(2) Shree Vallabhacharya - His Philosophy and Religion, by Prof. Jethalal G. Shah, 1969
Jai Shree Krushna !
Dharmendra
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117 Posts
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Posted - 25 October 2004 : 12:24:15
Jai Shree Krushna, Anjaliji!
I would say this question is not out of context, but asked a bit earlier than expected as i will put it in future while discussing philosophy. However, rather than putting you on hold, let me put the question in proper perspective. Building upon the explanations in the previous post, a person may belong to any social class, but as a spirit soul, he is a part and parcel of Supreme Lord who generated them for his divine sports. However, not all these souls can be identical for real play, so depending on the effect of Avidya, they have different natures.
Now, Yes, in Shreemad Bhagavad Geeta, Lord Krishna categorises souls in two categories : daivi (divine) and aasuri (demoniac) and their characteristics are mentioned there. However Shree Mahaprabhuji classifies them in three categories that all of us know : Pravahi, Maryada and Pushti. How are they related that i will post later.
Jai Shree Krushna !
Dharmendra
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shreekant22
PRO - Pushtikul.com / P.E.M. January 2004
1853 Posts
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Posted - 25 October 2004 : 12:54:26
Jai Shree Krishna
A well thought of and geniune reponce Dharmendraji. It is obvious, you have taken great care in preparing your reponce.
i would like to add that, The vedas, while giving the Divisions of the four castes and refering them parts of The Param Purush, have also clarified that these divisions are symbolic and made only for smooth function of the society, however, like all things that have its equal force in evil form too, took over and what was ment for betterment, itself became an evil.
Shree Vallabha dheesh ki jai
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